Ambush Alley Games Forum

[hedgehog]

Hi guys,

sorry if these are dumb questions, or previously asked questions, I couldn't find the answers in a trawl through the forum...

I have been persauded to build a 20mm Force, so i have decided on a 2003 era US Marine Infantry unit, but a few questions have come to mind...

1. For a full platoon I need 42 figures?

2. ...but how many HMG teams would I need to support this?

3. how many Javelin teams?

4. Are there any other support weapon teams i need apart from a sniper team?

5. What IFVs would a full platoon be transported in? how many would i need for that full platoon and support weapon teams.

6. is there any noticable difference, (in 20mm) between US Army and Marine uniform and Helmets?

so can i buy figures listed as US army for this Marine force?

7. Mind you I might do it as an Army Platoon instead, which would mean buying Bradley's as IFVs, ( I assume) so for a full Army platoon plus support weapon teams, how many Bradleys would i need?

My oppo is already building up his Iraqi force, so you can see we are aiming for a 2003 era conflict.

Thanks for any help you can offer.

Hedgehog

[amy crackhaus]

A US Marine platoon has 3 squads made up of three 4-man fireteam led by the squad leader. Usually headed by a platoon commander(2nd Lt. or a SNCO), Plt. Sgt is an SNCO or NCO, a guide, a Corpsman, and any weapons team that is attached.

1 platoon commander(M16)
1 Plt Sargent(M16)
1 guide(M16)
1 Corpman(M16)
3 squad leader(M16)
9 team leaders(M203)
9 SAW gunners
9 Assistant SAW gunner(M16)
9 rifleman(M16)

a marine rifle company has a weapons platoon , these will be dished out to the rifle units as needed . it has 3 60mm mortar and 6 mk153 smaw ( unique to the usmc ) .

the .50 cals and javelins are held in the battalion level heavy mg platoon
6 mk 19 , 6 .50 cal .

javelins are i believe held in the battalion anti armour platoon .

so any of the above could be dished out to the platoon commander as needed .

in 20mm u can pretty much use marines as armoured infantry as they both use the m16a2 . an armoured infantry squad is 9 men .
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'' I love my models , they are made of swiss cheese ''

[hedgehog]

Thanks for those details, appreciated.

I still don't know what IFVs the Marines used in Iraq in 2003. I did read about them using AAV-7A1 Amtracs, i was wondering how common that was?

Never the less, the ease of access to ebay Bradley's is seriously making me consider a change to Army!

Thanks again

Hedgehog

[Piers]

Dont forget the new Elhiem US stuff for Iraq 2003... Best figures in that scale for US.

Just doing up my USMC force using them and the seperate backpacks are very handy!

Im gonna do Amtracs for mine as Im focussing on An Nasiriyah. Will give them a few Hummers and M1s to support them.
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[amy crackhaus]

HH

a US mech platoon has 4 bradleys .. so not to expensive . the distribution of each sqd into its parent vehicle is odd ..

amtracs and LAV's are used in 2003 , they are issued from their parent units as required . each amtrac carries about 20 men , so u will need a max of 2 ( imho ) , each LAV only carries 4 men - so u will need a lot more .

the amtrac is very vulnerable , its armour is weak and is a big target ... avoid urban areas

[thatguy96]

[Clavicula_Nox]

[hedgehog]

Thanks for this guys, very much appreciated.

As it happens I ordered the Elheim US figures today and I have also ordered a load of Liberation figs too! Infact I have ordered 69 in total, way more than a platoon and even support!

I do like to be prepared.

I'm now seriously considering painting them as 2003 Army, but if need be I can pretend they're Marines! Bought a couple of SMAWs even!

( My reading had suggested that the Amtrak was indeed a rather massive and flimsy RPG magnet during the invasion! )

This means that I can buy Marine vehicles as well as Army vehicles! I'm a tread-head at heart. I suspect that the above plan could be close to heresy, especially with those of you on the Western side of the pond!

This is where somebody will tell me that the uniforms for Army and Marines are effectively the same in 20mm! (I know that is wishful thinking)

Two problems....

1. I have now have another 69 miniatures to clean up and paint...
2. I have too many incomplete armies being shunted back down the priority list, how am i going to get any of them finished? (Rhetorical question that one.)

thanks again, in a few months time I'll post the first minis that i finish.

Hedgehog

[Cerberus]

In 20 MM the difference in the uniforms is only in the camo pattern. The Marines use MARPAT and the Army uses ACU. Basicly like in most things the Marines uniform is sharp, squared away, and actually is very good at what it is supposed to do. The ACU on the other hand, like most things, Army trails behind the Marines in most things.

We do however share a dislike of the Greyhound busdrivers and the swabbys who dont know what an iorn is.

In all seriousness the Marines would be in the Desert MARPAT with woodland vests and 782 gear. The Army pics I have seen seems to be a mix of the two. Hopefully CN will be buy and tell you what he saw.

[Gunslinger]

I'm not even sure what threat to start off with jarhead. Trailing behind the Marines...

Oh I got it. "Hey there HOORAH, go scout for mines."

You're cammis DO look alot better than ours and as a bonus, they actually work. Credit where it's due.

Don't make me come over there!
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"Pain heals, chicks dig scars, but glory lasts forever."

[Clavicula_Nox]

2001-2003 Marines would be a mix of DCU and DESPAT uniforms similar to the wear out date issues the Army faced when switching to the ACU. If representing a force in Iraq, you could also paint them in woodland BDU to represent their MOPP suits with DCU helmet covers. 2004 is going to be predominantly DESPAT and 2005+ is going to be exclusively DESPAT*.

The next issue is a question of vests. For 2001-2003, you're best painting everyone with woodland IBAs. As you advance the years, you would find a steadily increasing ratio of Coyote Brown (or whatever it's called) vests that the Marines started switching to from the IBA. For a 2005+ force, most (if not all)of them will be in the brown marine vest.**






*I'm sure there is some outlier out there. I don't want someone coming around with a picture of one guy in 2009, or something, wearing something other than DESPAT and saying "See! OMG, they don't just wear DESPAT! LOL!"


** See *
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Sine Pari

[Clavicula_Nox]

Army uniforms are sorta the same.

2001-2003: Mix DCU uniforms with woodland IBAs and woodland ALICE/MOLLE stuff.

2004: As above, but start doing a few desert vests (but not many) and very few (if any) desert ALICE/MOLLE

2005: Mostly desert IBAs with a few woodland vests running around for guys who show up just before deployment, or if RIF ran out of their size. Same-same for ALICE/MOLLE; high priority infantry type units should be mostly matching with desert stuff.

2006+: ACU/DCU mix, but with most vests and gear being ACU

2007+: ACU everything

2010: Multicam uniforms; ACU gear

2011: Multicam everything*

2012: Retreat; back to ACUs*

*Prediction
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Sine Pari

[hedgehog]

Again, thanks guys, much appreciated.

I knew I was going to set off an inter-service squabble with my indecision over Marines or Army, sorry about that!

Why, you might ask, aren't I doing a UK force?

Oh I will, I will!
Thanks

Hedge

[Echo5Hotel]

[Clavicula_Nox]